Pat Turner, the Man with a Plan Valuer’s Dozen

by Woody Fincham, SRA, AI-RRS, RAA Member of RAC

pat turner

 

I have known Pat Turner for many years.  My first introduction to him was from attending a Virginia State Board meeting.  I had attended to give public commentary about the problems I saw with regulatory oversight in the commonwealth.  Pat and I struck up a conversation outside the meeting in the hallway where we discussed my disappointment with how the board looked at enforcement.  I explained to him that I was rather passionate about it.  To which he replied, ” Woody, if you have half the fight in you that I do about this profession, you will make some changes happen in the profession.”  If you know Pat at all, you know how true to his nature that reply really is.  Pat has led the charge in trying to advocate for the appraisal profession for many, many years. When I received my SRA designation Pat is the man that handed it to me, at my request.  That is how much think of him, and I know many that think highly of him as well.  I am proud to get the chance to share the Valuer’s Dozen with you, as Pat is one of my mentors and one of my friends.

VN:  How long have you been in the profession?

PT: 46.5 years

 

VN: What is your favorite thing about the profession?

PT:  I love the research and analyzing the actions of the market.

 

VN: Who are your mentors and idols within the profession?

PT: My mentors were:
Jim Faulconer, Chesterfield Assessor
Dick Farmer, Assessor of Henrico County and instructor for the Society of Real Estate Appraisers
Bob Barton, MAI and an instructor and friend
Woody Aaron, MAI, instructor and friend

 

VN: What are some of your passions inside the profession?

PT: My passion is to do the best I can in all that I undertake as an appraiser.  As you know, I am passionate about consumer protection and the appraisal profession as a whole.

 

VN: What are some passions of yours outside of the profession?

PT: My wife, children, grandchildren.  University of Richmond. My close friends because they know my many faults and like me anyway.

 

VN: Where do you see the profession in 3 years?  5 years?  10 years?

PT: In 3 years we will have new Fannie and Freddie reporting vehicles, if they are still viable.
In 5 years we appraisers better be getting more and better education because the mortgage part will be dissolving as we know it.  Take the best educational classes offered.  Be prepared for legal work, IRS work, work from accountants, etc.

 

VN: What is one thing about your personal business that you are most proud?

PT: Reputation and longevity, despite all the bumps along the way.

 

VN: If you could change one thing about your business model what would it be?

PT: Ban AMCs or at least make them more transparent regarding C & R fees.

 

VN:  What are some present goals for you and what you do are doing in the valuation space?

PT: My present goal is to assist my daughter to obtain her licenses.

 

VN:   If you could change one thing in valuation, what would it be?

PT: What would I change?  The lack of enforcement, which is due to insufficient knowledge of our profession, in my opinion.

 

VN:  What advice would you give someone just getting in the profession?

PT: Get the best education available.  Please use the LIVE classroom.  Join the American Society of Appraisers as they are rapidly becoming the representative for residential appraisers.

 

VN: This last one is for you to discuss or talk about whatever you would like.

PT:  Finally, I would recommend that people get involved.  Not only with our profession, but also social and civic activities.  Your personality and knowledge impress more people than you know.  Be a leader.  But if you can’t be a leader, then follow, or get out of the way.

The Valuer in The Mirror

Written by Woody Fincham, SRA, AI-RRS, RAA 

Maybe I am crazy, but I think all of us deserve a better profession as appraisers than what we have presently within the mortgage and lending world.  We are in an era where the profession is changing fast.  We have many players out there that want to limit or possibly eliminate real estate valuations for residential lending and to some degree on the non-residential side of things as well. The profession should be aligning itself to battle this, but we seem more fractured now than we have ever been.  There is too much in-fighting and disagreement among key players in the profession.  This ranges from the individuals that have appeared as leaders and with the organizations that make up the professional trade groups and professional membership organizations for real estate appraisers.

man-looking-in-mirror

The Valuer in The Mirror

The profession is fractured.  We need to take a long hard look at ourselves in the mirror.  We need to do it as individuals and as part of the various organizations out there.  We need to start seeing ourselves as we really are, warts and all.  There is not one organization out there that is going to save the valuation profession.  There is no one organization that is to blame for all the issues we deal with as a profession. Humans love to separate into groups and then immediately set upon the other groups out there as being somehow inferior to your group.

We have reached a point where we need to stop and take stock of what the profession needs.  We are at a point where the fractures are weakening what we can be as a profession.  When I was speaking on the leadership panel at AppraiserFest last year, that was the one thing I tried to get across.  Stop with the tribalism and fracturing into groups.  Stop trying to say your team is the only viable voice out there.  All valuation voices matter.

I think the answer is to start by being open to all the various groups out there and seeing the positives in each rather than the negatives.  Every professional group out there adds some positivity to the mix.  Whether you, as a valuation professional, are a member of a group or not we must see the value in a unified front.  Remember, that what we do for the US Economy is a thankless job.  One of our biggest user groups, lenders, are also one of the biggest groups that see what we do as an inconvenience rather than a protection of the public trust.  It seems with all the alternative valuation products that are constantly being pushed over traditional appraisals that they would rather see us replaced than to deal with us.

Within the organizations themselves the jockeying for individual position holds the organizations back from being truly great. The politics are cut throat and reward those seeking personal gain more than profession-oriented growth. Most of the long tenured organizations are a political nightmare that are more leadership driven than membership driven. I truly do not understand what one gets from hurting others in their jockeying for a position.  All this type of behavior does is make individual appraisers not want to participate, thus weakening both the organizations and the individuals.

What should we be doing?

The worst thing any of us can be doing is not participating in the profession.  Many, many folks are vocal on forums and social media yet have no membership or involvement with any organizations.  What good does it do to complain but do nothing?  There are lots of folks that want change to happen but that means you must get plugged in somewhere.  Anywhere.  Join a state coalition or one of the national organizations.  Sitting on the fence and complaining will get the profession, and you, nowhere.

If you have the time attend the meetings and add your voice to the mix.  Be opened minded when you are at these meetings and be open to changing your mind about some things.  Many of us that use social media get hard-headed about somethings and forget to listen.  What I notice with in-person meetings is that social graces tend to come back.  People are not so myopic in person (usually) and we tend to be politer in person.  On social media folks can sometimes lose their connection with manners.

Not one person reading this, or the knuckle-head writing this, knows everything.  If you are not open to discourse in a professional manner, then you may want to reassess yourself.  I have found myself feeling very strongly on certain things, only to find out later that I probably should have looked at it differently.  This is true of being a member of an organization.  No organization is perfect, and they all mess up time to time. All these organizations are run by people and people make mistakes.

Any valuation organization out there worth the cost of their membership should be doing multiple meetings with the other valuation organizations out there several times a year.  While we cannot expect them all to agree on all things, they need to be exchanging information and ideas.  Some sort of valuation congress.  Even the largest organizations have weaknesses that another organization can help with.  Some organizations are residentially focused where others are commercially focused.  That’s fine.  But each organization needs to accept that

What Should We Not Be Doing?

We are an opinionated lot.  We get paid to tell others our opinions, and we dig in like a tick when we make up our minds.  Many of us are great appraisers but we lack a true understanding of other things. We are a group of professionals that excel at market research that leads to supportable conclusions yet lack the same set of skills when it comes to the larger profession. I cannot tell you how many times I speak with colleagues that have some strong opinions about something related to the profession.  Then I find out that they have never read about or researched the topic at hand but had come to their seemingly strong opinion based on conjecture.  Often, they have heard another’s opinion on the topic and drawn a conclusion from hearsay. We must treat opinions from others like we do comparable sales data. Research it and find support for it, don’t just take the opinion as fact.

If we concentrate and expend energy on the negativity out there, we are taking energy away from doing something positive.  Those that seek to make money off us as professionals benefit form the distraction in-fighting creates.  While we spend time finding more reasons to fracture apart further, they continue making money off our work.  Some also are using that advantage to try and replace us.  It is okay to agree to disagree, it is not okay to try and attack someone just because they disagree with you.

Once you are involved with an organization do not put yourself before the whole.  Trying to earn a position at the expense of a colleague is not a good thing.  I have seen some colleagues turn into bullies and try to use politics to hurt others to gain a position or to unseat a colleague.  If that is your M.O. you are better off not getting involved.  Many need to ask themselves, “Are you trying to help out or is what you are doing going to hurt what the organization is doing?”

 

In the End

We are a small group of professionals.  There are, by my account, approximately 75,000 professionals nationwide.  We do not have the same lobbying power as the lenders out there.  To be honest, the only reason that we have lasted this long is that some legislators see the benefit that we add to protecting the national economy.  Since we are so small it is imperative that we cease the fracturing from within.  Find an organization that you can support and work with them.  Volunteer and stay involved.  Organizations cannot work against their members if the members do not become passive.  Passiveness is what has hurt the profession more than anything.  Well that and bad business practices, but that is another blog post for another time.

Find an organization, or a couple of them, to work with and volunteer to do some work.  Do not wait for someone else to try and solve your problems for you.  Sitting back and watching what others do will not work at all.  Between the different organizations out there look for ones that align with your thoughts and ones that seem open to you and your views.  Not every organization for everyone, and even after you lock into one, over time, you may find that someplace else ends up being a better place for you, for that time.

If you have limited time, find an organization that you can support and join.  Like anything, not everyone can always get really involved, but your support of the organization makes funds available to help the profession.